U.N.I.O.N.
United for No Injustice, Oppression or Neglect

Inmate Wins Federal Case



 
 

 

Inmate wins federal case
Jury directs Folsom staffers to pay $39,000 in punitive damages.
By Denny Walsh - dwalsh@sacbee.com
Published 12:00 am PST Sunday, November 11, 2007

A federal court jury has found an inmate's constitutional right to be free of cruel and unusual punishment was violated when he was deprived of outdoor exercise during four extended lockdowns at a state prison in Folsom.

The jury awarded Gregory Lynn Norwood only $11 in nominal compensatory damages but also directed six high-ranking current and former corrections officials to pay Norwood a total of $39,000 in punitive damages.

Punitive damages are meant to punish and make an example of defendants and to deter others from similar conduct.

According to a trial brief filed on behalf of the corrections officials, lockdowns are normally recommended by the facility captain and approved by the prison's warden.

Cheryl Pliler, a former warden at the prison, was assessed $16,000 in punitive damages. Another former warden, Mike Knowles, who is also retired, was assessed $3,000; Thomas Goughnour, a former associate warden who is retired, $5,500; James Walker, a former associate warden who is now the prison's warden, $1,500; Steve Vance, still a captain at the prison, $11,500; David Willey, a former prison captain who now works in the Sacramento headquarters of the Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation, $1,500.

The jury of seven women and one man deliberated nine hours and returned its verdict Thursday.

At the heart of Norwood's civil rights lawsuit were the four lockdowns of the facility where he was housed at California State Prison, Sacramento also known as New Folsom in 2002 and 2003. The lockdowns stemmed from separate prisoner attacks on staff.

African American general population prisoners in B Facility, of which Norwood was one, were locked down for 14 of the 22 months from Jan. 4, 2002, to Nov. 4, 2003.

Norwood, 46, who is doing life without parole on first-degree murder and second-degree robbery convictions, claimed the lockdowns deprived him of outdoor exercise, resulting in stress, anxiety, depression, headaches and muscle cramps.

He contended the lockdowns were needlessly prolonged, ostensibly for security reasons, but actually as punishment and retaliation.

Investigations of stabbing assaults involving staff take months, while investigations of incidents that do not implicate staff are completed in a matter of days, Norwood claimed.

He alleged the stabbing assaults that gave rise to the lockdowns were spontaneous and isolated incidents and there was no continuing threat from the general population.

During a lockdown, according to the defendants' trial brief, all normal programs are canceled and inmates are confined to their cells seven days a week, 24 hours a day, with the exception of a five-minute shower every other day, excluding Sundays.

Lockdowns are meant to allow prison staff time to investigate the events that triggered them, prevent further incidents, remove and isolate inmates responsible, and diffuse tensions under controlled conditions, the defendants' trial brief says.

Norwood represented himself throughout the life of the suit, which was filed in December 2003.

But things took an unusual turn midway through the trial.

Circumstances convinced U.S. District Judge Garland E. Burrell Jr., who was presiding, that Norwood may unwittingly have deprived himself of a fair trial. On Nov. 1, the judge sought assistance for Norwood from the University of California, Davis, School of Law Civil Rights Clinic.

With very short notice and the trial in recess, two law students and Carter White, director of the clinic, met with Norwood, conducted an abbreviated investigation and prepared questions for witnesses.

The students, Erin Haney and Nagmeh Shariatmadar, questioned corrections officials who testified, and White questioned an inmate who corroborated many of Norwood's claims. White also made the rebuttal closing argument on behalf of Norwood.

While students have often represented prisoners in the 14 years of the clinic's existence, they had never been on the winning side of a jury trial, White said in an interview.

"It's very difficult to persuade a jury that corrections officials should not be accorded deference in the operation of a prison," he noted. "In this instance, the jurors wanted to send a different message. They clearly saw their role in this as righting a wrong."

Before excusing the jury, Burrell told its members they had given life to the phrase "equal justice under law."



71 Comments Posted

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Insightful_genius at 7:34 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

There are many lawsuits filed, it is good to see one has won

Many of these same people are also named in K'napp vs. Hickman which has a federal courtdate of April 4, 2008. If you have PACER you can read it online. The case number is CIV-S-05-02520. Press conferences were held and articles written about UNION famillies' medical neglect lawsuits were filed for Donald Swisher, three filed by Nora Weber for Mark Grangetto, Rev. Andre Shumake for Anthony Shumake's death by dental infection, three filed by the family of Danny Provencio. While it is almost impossible to win these lawsuits, it is the only form of accountability that the guards, administrators and those who are callous to desperate appeals of suffering men and women will likely ever receive. Complaints to local grand juries as well as complaints to the Office of Internal Affairs will often result in an investigation. One complaint might not matter but twenty complaints DO matter. There is a risk of retaliation for going to the media and filing a complaint but unless this is done, 

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Insightful_genius at 7:39 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

cont. from above

then the abuses continue. Locking people down for 23 to 24 hours a day is beyond cruel and unusual, yet almost all the men's prisons are doing it routinely. Lawsuits and initiative campaigns are the only language these abusive punishers understand and it is important to support the lawsuits by attending them and writing to editors about conditions inside the prisons. The media is banned, so unless the families post at the news sites, they cannot know about this cruelty, the riots, the suspicious deaths, the suicides and the disease outbreaks. The families who have sued are the ones who are bringing about reform, even though when this is done without money, or even with money, the chances of winning are very slim. Accountability of all responsible and all callous to appeals comes from filing lawsuits. If you want to see more complaints and more lawsuits filed until the message gets delivered that torture is unacceptable then get active in the UNION and learn. Lives depend on it.

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Billyuns at 7:54 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

MAKES ME SICK.

How much money do the Officers who got assaulted to start the lockdown in the dirst place get from the inmates? Inmates, Probationers, Parolees, never pay their restitution, why should the Corrections staff? Makes me sick to see this puke get 39k for commisary while he spends life in Prison. Maybe he should be made to give that money back to the state for the free hosing and meals he gets for the rest of his life.

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Bridgette at 8:28 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

I'm against any "Criminal" being able to sue...

the only good thing about the "Criminal" getting $$ is that IT must go TO THEIR VICTIMS OR TO PAY FOR THEIR LODGING INSTEAD OF THE TAXPAYER. 
Plus I don't think "Criminals" should have any rights whiile in jail. Let them excercise in their jail cells. 
I feel sorry for their families, but more for their victims that never get closer. Especially the ones on death row that are still breathing 20 years after they killed their victim. Lethal injection is cruel.. that's a lot better than what they did to their victims. If they don't want the injection, then execute them in the same way they killed their victims. Now that would be cruel! 
We need JOE ARPAIO, MARICOPA ARIZONA COUNTY SHERIFF, here in California. Check out the web page: http://www.mcso.org/ 
Our prisions need to become self-sufficient and generate an income for the State instead of creating an albatross around our necks. 
 
 
 
 
 

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robertemily at 8:49 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

punishment

How else do you punish somebody who is serving a life sentence for murder? Add more time to their sentence? When you break the law, such as murdering somebody, and are sent to prison for it, you are being punished. Part of that punishment is living within the prison system. If you want to go outside and play everyday, don't do something that will get you thrown in jail. What kind of system do we have where a convicted murderer can go to court, and win money, because he thinks his punishment is cruel and unusual. Cruel and unusual in MY world, is taking the live of another person. 

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impalas65 at 9:06 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

 

This inmate has victims. Any money should immediately be awarded to the the victims or their family members. Or this inmate should be sued by the victims. This my friends, is "Equal justice under the law".

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Plaso20 at 9:06 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Our System Must Change

What a load of crap! 

Instead of trying to protect him they should have let him out to get stabbed.

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ebanning at 9:46 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Can you say appeal?

Certainly this case will be appealed. Sad day when the inmates run the prisons! Hey, I got an idea, avoid the whole thing by NOT going to prison in the first place! Wow, that probably would work....naw ...they'd find some other way to separate honest, hard working tax payers from their money. Probably how they ended up there in the first place...it's called armed robbery! 

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iguana at 9:54 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Jurors should have to run the prison

Seems only fair that the jurors and judge that made the decision should have to run the prison now. If theyre saying they know better than the high ranking CDC personnel about how to run a prison then let them back it up. 
CDC is in charge of incarcerating criminals, not running a resort for convicted first degree murderers.

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sac11550 at 10:24 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Stupid jury!

I can't believe how stupid this jury was! Give a convicted murder money because he had to sit in his cell! Every member of that jury should be hunted down by the tax payers and beat like a child molester!

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ihatecriminals at 10:54 AM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

 

I wonder if this dirtbag is gonna share any of that money with the family of the person he killed.....Probably not......I guess he can buy alot of Top Ramen with $39,000 though..

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SoleTaxPayer at 1:13 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Did anyone else notice

Did anyone else notice how many wardens had been at that prison? im wondering if its one of those gigs thats in place so state empoyees can max out on thier retirement.I don't understand how inmates can sue,they can't vote!As far as prison as an instution goes why doesn't america export its criminals like the rest of the world does to the U.S.

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zzyzx_exit at 1:42 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Moronic comments

Nearly every comment above is moronic and totally uninformed. Examples ... 

Bridgette: So you are against inmates being able to sue? Well, lets abolish our constitution then. The money will not go to the victims unless there is a court order, nor will the money go for lodging.

Billyuns: Inmates and parolees DO pay their restitution. Any money earned are received while in prison is garnished at a rate of 55%.

If inmates were deprived of the right to sue then you would see many innocent sent to prison and innocent people executed as well. remember this case was presented and a jury AFTER HEARING ALL THE FACTS found the sued parties guilty. What part of OUR laws and CONSTITUTION do you not get? If the same jury found the inmate was at fault you would not even comment.

You people who are quick to tear up our constitution better stop and think about the consequences. If ya want to live in Iran or Afghanistan, then move there and you will enjoy the world as you envision it.

Get a life!

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jbattles at 2:45 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Let the Jury

have a walk through of California State Prison Sacramento.. Maybe then they will have a little perspective. As a former Medical Techincal Assistant at CSP-Sacramento, I recall Warden Walker to be one of the most professional men working in Corrections. His first responsibilty was always to see to the safety of both staff and other inmates. Part of the problem is that most Sacramentans do not realize that there are two prisons in Sacramento; Folsom and CSP Sacramento which both house around 3,200 inmates (or 6,400 total). CSP Sacramento is by far the more dangerous of the two and having worked in the clinics there I can attest that there are nearly daily stabbings at the facility. The only way to combat the violence is to investigate each threat, search for weapons, move inmates within the facility and at times, keep the facilities locked down and let them cool their heels. The jury ruled in favor of the inmate without having the first clue of why they are locked down.

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Insightful_genius at 2:46 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Military research shows that group punishments do not work

There are at least 40,000 prisoners in the system who are mentally ill and one of them is always going to breaking some "rule" because they cannot follow rules. That is what makes them mentally ill. So the ridiculous non-solution is always to lock down the entire prison for weeks and months at a time. Most often the lockdowns are because something turns up "missing" The yards are not enjoined, so a missing item could not possibly be found on some other yard but ALL the cells are often locked down. The law says that prisoners are to be let out into the sunshine, which they need for their health, for vitamin D and other purposes, not to mention psychological to survive, for at least one hour a day. I am amazed at the guards on this thread who do not want to follow the law. The courts are corrupt from arrest through parole which they won't find out until they're hauled in for something, so why do they still assume that everyone in prison is guilty of a crime? Why are guards cruel?

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Insightful_genius at 2:53 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Lockdowns give the taxpayers an extra burden

Not only does isolation and confinement in a room no larger than a small bathroom drive men mad, creating more mental illness in our society which benefits no one, lockdowns interfere with a number of processes. The one that puts a burden on the court system is the constant need to grant extensions in legal cases due to the lack of access to the legal library. Missed doctor's appointments often result in death or permanent disability because lockdown means little or no movement. Teachers are being paid to instruct inmates but when a lockdown is in effect, they cannot attend classes, so our taxpayer money is wasted. The guards love lockdown because it gives them an easy job, but it also costs the taxpayers a great deal of money and the human toll is immeasurable. Children cannot get phone calls from their fathers during months and years of lockdown, destroying family ties and creating tension and anxiety on the entire family. Inmates have cases in progress, lives to live

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Insightful_genius at 3:01 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Prisons do not furnish all the basic needs

When a prisoner is awarded money, it helps him be able to pay for postage, his legal work and basic personal grooming supplies. The prisons do not provide a healthy diet and another form of cruelty for which they all need to be sued is the unhealthy starvation diets of processed, high fat, high salt, cancer-causing foods that are causing health problems throughout the system. It is almost impossible to get fresh fruits and vegetables let alone any real meat which provides actual protein even in prison. They get 30 cents for a copy when most prisoners make 9 cents an hour if they have a job. Too often basics like paper, pencil, envelopes are denied even when a case is in progress and there are rules about providing indigent inmates tools. Unfortunately the guards and administrators think they are above the law. Go to PACER and you will see many of these same individuals sued several times over, it's about time a jury insisted laws be respected by criminals wearing badges. 

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Insightful_genius at 3:22 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Constant lockdowns are a Guard Scam for Overtime

Even though the law forbids constant cell searching as it is psychologically demeaning and traumatic for a prisoner to have his "home" turned upside down and legal papers, irreplacable family pictures destroyed or thrown into the toilet, which the guards do on a regular basis, lockdowns often bring these about. If a prison has about 4,000 cells that constantly need "searching", large teams of guards can be brought in to do this. The entire process usually takes weeks, sometimes as long as six. For prisons where extra guards are not brought in, cell searches represents millions in overtime money. This is a scam on the taxpayers and a missing plastic tray should not be a reason to lockdown an entire prison for weeks and months at a time but such is the case. There are a maximum lockdown rules, so when the time comes to let the prisoners off lockdown, the prison admin does so and then a couple of days later a new lockdown can begin. It's costing millions to torture people in this way

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leslem at 3:23 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

 

I am embarassed for the law students at UC Davis -- it is small wonder that lawyers are not held in high esteem. Please defend deserving people. Did they think of the pain the victim's family has suffered?

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jlbuchanan at 3:54 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

zzyzx, Danny Walsh, Judge Burrell

After reading some of these comments, you know why our country is in trouble....It's always amazing how many people don't know anything about the law or the constitution. 

Educate yourself, before embarrassing yourself. You very well could be the next victim of our over zealous court system. 
Kudos to Danny Walsh for this story, to Judge Burrell for knowing the law, and to zzyzx for knowing the truth.

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player13 at 5:18 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

what is wrong with society today

Poor baby, he had to stay in his cell all day. This guy is in prison because he murdered somebody. for those of you who say what about the constitution and this inmates right...well what about his victems right to live...He could have cared less about the poor victem he murdered or the family of the victem. This guy should rot in hell for his crime and if on this earth, prison is the closes thing then so be it. Everybody is alway worried about the inmates rights and the conditions they live in, well don't do the crime if you don't want to live like that. I would love to see all these people that are so concerned with these inmate while in prison let them live in there neighborehoods when they get out. So when these molesters, killers and rapist get out, let them live next to all you hug-a-thug people who feel these guys should have all these rights. To zzyzx/jlbuchanan you are the reason why guys like this commit crime...they know if they get locked up people like you will defend them.

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zzyzx_exit at 6:13 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

TO: player13 and other like minded persons

I arm myself with truth and knowledge ... not assumptions and knee jerk reactions. This article has nothing to do with the inmates commitment offense, it has to do with OUR laws and OUR constitution. Maybe you should take a moment and read OUR constitution and OUR bill of rights.

The article and the inmates case is about civil right, constitutional rights ... that WE all are protected by. Do away with OUR constitution and OUR bill of rights and we are no better than a third world communist dictatorial society. All of you who scream about this inmate winning his case against cruel and unusual punishment will be the first to cry like babies when YOUR rights are trampled on.

We are a country of laws and those laws govern ALL of us, not just a select few. If you don't like OUR laws and OUR court system, I suggest that you lobby to have our constitution repealed and lower the stars and stripes from every flag pole.

I fought hard defending OUR constitution ... what have you done?
 
 

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johnniebgoode at 6:29 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Libs would rather have him on the streets

and then ponder, "Gee, the crime rate is up. I wonder why?"

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leslem at 7:29 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

 

zzyzx 
There are laws to be followed, we do have a constitution - the problem I have with this law suit is that an award went to a person who broke the law, did not follow the rules of the land. This man lost some of his priviledges when he broke the law - he made the choice and then did not seem to like the consequences of his choice. People with mental illness need to have their illness addressed both outside and inside of prison. Unfortunately, so many ill people, can't because of the illness, take their meds and the circle goes around and around. I do feel that too many people today feel they can do what they so wish and then say "what happened".

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Insightful_genius at 7:44 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

There are no crime statistics anywhere to prove prisons, jails deter or prevent crime

Visit the attorney general's website and you will see that the violent crime rate has fluctuated very little since the 1980's if manipulated statistics can be believed. There are no statistics anywhere that prisons, jails, juvenile halls, harsh laws or the death penalty deter crime or even reduce the crime rate. Next time some Repug politician is spouting this lie, ask them what their source is because evidence of any benefit to torture whatsoever doesn't exist. The only real way to reduce crime is through the prevention of substance abuse and mental illness and support of our young people through FREE after school activities, giving them jobs and just loving them. The people who sit on the jury read the news. They made this decision and about three million potential voters who suffer right along with the prisoners when they are on lockdown are cheering their decision. If the taxpayers only knew about the murder and torture going on behind the bars, they would never stand for it

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player13 at 7:55 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

To: azzyzx, you ask, what have you done?

azzyzx, you ask what I have done? My family come from a back ground of men and women who served in ww1, ww2, and vietnam, so don't question what I have done. We all have a right to our constitution and its benifits, but once you decide to take some else right to live or be safe in their enviroment you should lose some of those benifits our constitution provides you. I don't believe in cruel and unusual punishment either, but to award this inmate 30K is just opening the gateway for other inmates to sue because of lock downs. Lock downs in prison are common and necessary. If it take 1 week to 1 year so be it. Most inmates are aware of the consquences of their crime and the punishment they could receive for their crimes. You say this case is about the constitution and peoples rights. Wrong, this case is about a person who killed in cold blood and now is pissed off because he is serving life in prison and now our cdcr employees and the state have to pay once again. 

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Folsom345 at 8:17 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Insightful Genius

It is very apparent from your multiple, one-side posts that you have some involvement with inmate rights. I dont have time to spend all day countering your extremely biased arguments, but let me counter one mis-truth. You state that the media is barred from prisons. Not true. But you already know that, don't you?

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zzyzx_exit at 8:20 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

TO: leslem

The protections of OUR constitution are not a privilege, they are a right. The state violated this inmates rights and all the other inmates rights when they subjected them to what the jury found to be cruel and unusual punishment. Even those inmates who are confined to administrative segregation have a right to "x" number of hours of fresh air and sunshine. If you and others disagree with this, argue your case in front of the U.S. Supreme Court. 

Prisoners are not to be subjected to cruel and unusual treatment, like it or not, that IS the law. This is the United States of America ... don't like it ... lobby and have the constitution scrapped along with all of your protections.

It's sad that you and others live in this great nation and you do not even know what is contained in OUR constitution ... the same constitution that affords the falsely accused to challenge the system and gain freedom. The law protects all citizens, not just a select group.

See Amendment XIV

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SoleTaxPayer at 8:42 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

yOU KIDS ARE WRONG!

Let me get this straight, this guy murdered some poor soul.Then the taxpayers of this fine state paid cops to investigate and arrest him.Then paid a judge, a prosecutor,and a public defender for a trial.The taxpayers then build a prison to house him with a yard to play in I might add. Then the taxpayers pay a guard to keep him safe and feed him.So now his feelings are hurt so he enlists the help of some kids at a taxpayer subsidised state school to sue current and former employees paid by taxpayers.AND THEY SAY CRIME DOESN'T PAY!!!!!!!!

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imaami at 8:52 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

I really don't feel sorry for any inmate during lock down.

They are all there doing time for crimes that they did commit.

Do we have innocent people in jail at this time. Most likely yes.

But during a riot or any out break of violence a lock down in required to prevent harm to both the guards and inmates.

I will most likely never see the inside walls of either one of these places. I do believe that the victims are the only ones who constitutional rights have been destroyed by these criminals.

Victims of violent crimes fear for their lives everyday after the crime through PTSD the criminal took away their lives and security. Why should I or anyone else feel sorry for someone who stole the rights of an innocent person.

I am not a bleeding heart person for criminals, I am a supporter of the victims.

Prison lockdown is nothing compared to being locked down in your own home afraid to open a doors or windows to let in the sun or fresh air.

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banjobob2 at 10:06 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Studid or What?

The low life's who run the stupid Department of Corrections have no idea who are what is going on within the prisons in which they are supposed to be running. Arnold, I thought you were a smart guy, but I see now that you are a little girlie man.!!!!!!!!!. (Yes you are a a wimp!)

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Insightful_genius at 10:41 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

Folsom345

You're not countering my arguments because you don't have conflicting info. The media may not see a specific inmate when a crisis is reported and if you read the news you could see that the California Newspaper Publisher's Association and all patriots who revere the First Amendment are up in arms over the Governor's veto of very important bills. When someone is suffering the media cannot get into verify it. One stupid move was made however, and that was to imprison and abuse the loved ones of four veteran journalists whose words are taken seriously and who are expert at gathering evidence of wrongdoing. You obviously work at Folsom or you wouldn't have such a screen name. Those who witness these abuses and do nothing are a party to torture and for what good reason? Abusing people in prison does not help them to become better citizens. One 22 year old mentally ill young man slit his wrists this weekend over excessive isolation at SVSP. Go get the story for the media if you can

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shellabella at 11:57 PM PST Sunday, November 11, 2007 wrote:

hatred is the poison of human life

I'm tired of the whining. I'm tired of the immature retribution/desire for "justice." Anyone and EVERYONE can have justice if they deal with their own emotions instead of running around blaming others. I don't care of the other party is actually guilty, you will never heal by "getting justice." No level of justice will heal ANYONE. I look forward to the day when mankind finally realizes that we are all responsible for our own lives and for how we feel. Once that happens, we also need to show love for all human beings regardless of the wrongs they may have done. They wrong out of pain - they clearly need the healing as much as the victim. Victims need to stop riding the victim train and realize that one incident is not sufficient to CHOOSE to make the rest of their own life miserable. If the victim died as a result of the "criminal's" actions, then perhaps it was their time - they may have died some other way anyway. The families will not HEAL by getting justice. 

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one2vegas at 4:38 AM PST Monday, November 12, 2007 wrote:

Insightful genius,and zzyzx_exit, are right on target,with their comments !!

It is about time a jury insisted that laws be respected by criminals wearing badges,sending a clear message,to those who,for too long have been breaking the law,and getting away with it.Intelligent people are saying,enough is enough !! 
The evidence,had to be overwhelmingly striking,and clearly found to be true and correct. 
The $$$ award should have been much higher,for this inmate,who is paying for his crime,by incarceration as his punishment.Torture and abuse are not included,in this mans sentence,he still has constitutional rights,civil rights and human rights,available to him. 
We as a people,must realize,the importance of all Our Rights,under the Constitution,which is our only true protection,from all corrupted corporations,who operate their evils,against these laws. 
Until,the prison industrial corporation,changes its behaviors,there will be more lawsuits,filed,because the families of all inmates,are disgusted,with how their loved ones, are being treated and how they are treated. 
Lawsuits,will force them to get attorneys,and spend money,they may not have to defend themselves,then,they will have a taste of what some of these prisoners,have gone through !!! 
 

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ZzyzxExit at 7:13 AM PST Monday, November 12, 2007 wrote:

TO: Folsom345

Most of us who post here know that "Insightful_genius" is an expert at run on comments that rapidly depart from the topic. However, his comment that the media is barred from prisons is not entirely untrue.

Yes, the media does have access to correctional facilities. But first they must jump through more hoops than most circuses animals see in a life time. Further, the media has limited ability to interview specific or random inmates. I direct you to Department Operations Manual 13010.8 Media Access to Facilities and SUBCHAPTER 4. GENERAL
INSTITUTION REGULATIONS Article 1. Public Information and Community Relations 3260. Public Access to Facilities and Programs.

The time lag between request and actual interview of an inmate by the media is such that access is a joke. The days of free media access are gone because the CDCR (Communicable Disease Collection & Redistribution) fears the truth getting out. With current policy things get swept under the rug long before access is granted.

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cyeager at 7:16 AM PST Monday, November 12, 2007 wrote:

Cruel?

Cruel is burning at the stake, shot, or hung without Trial. 
After Trial most get a retirement. Albiet, small territory. But still. Retirement.
Now. Take over payed understaffed prison. Put a few really not so calm prisoners in. And....
Give them individual rights.
It's a raw deal to by 'Law' require certain rights like the right to get so much time out of the cell. 
For one. Lockdown requires far more work for the officers. Missing even one staff member makes a difference. It's life or death.
Now here's a guy whom has won 39,000 over a Law. Raw. The inmate also by 'Law' has a ton of restitution. The next article I wish to see is the money snatched up so fast it was a blur passing in the night.
s/b
"NEW ARTICLE:
New Legislation To Deter Frivolous Law Suits From Prisoners Drops 90 Percent Of Cases Filed."
Cause thats the other problem. Fact.

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leslem at 8:19 AM PST Monday, November 12, 2007 wrote:

 

zzyzx 
I understand the Constitution gives us the right to protection from cruel and unusual punishment- was the person's victim protected from cruel and unusual punishment - where was the victim's protection. It is too bad the man was in a lockdown - but I am going to think that he chose to take another's rights away and now he wants justice for himself. Sometimes, we have to live with the consequences of our choices. 

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Insightful_genius at 9:58 AM PST Monday, November 12, 2007 wrote:

Leslem, the guards must follow the laws and not decide they are there to punish

There are guards committing worse crimes against humanity than 70% of the prisoners because they have an attitude that they are above the law. As more members of the juries lose friends and relatives to the blood houses, we will see more curtailing of the law enforcement and legislative gangs that are terrorizing and destroying families for minor crimes. When the guards are on trial themselves, they will stop torturing people, which is not their job. Only lawsuits, electing the right people to office and initiative campaigns can stop this madness that is doing nothing to benefit society. Ever wonder why California has the highest prisoner suicide rate in the country? Look to continual lockdowns and ad seg isolation for the answer to that burning question. No one will ever know how many suicide attempts are made, and I wonder what kind of monsters would want to participate in and support such dark practices. What kind of mental illness drives people to believe lockdowns are good?

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leslem at 10:15 AM PST Monday, November 12, 2007 wrote:

 

20 years ago it was said to me "society is going to hell in a hand basket!" - I leave it to you!

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tdrake at 12:20 PM PST Monday, November 12, 2007 wrote:

DEATH OF LOVED ONE, GLAD SOMEONE FINALLY GOT JUSTICE

I FOR ONE KNOW, THAT PRISON IS NOT A GREAT PLACE, OUR LOVED ONE DIED AT THE HANDS OF PEOPLE NOT CARING FOR HIM, OR WRONGFUL DEATH IN SEPTEMBER OF THIS YEAR. THEY GIVE YOU PILLS AGAINIST YOUR WILL, MIND CONTROL, AND SAY IT IS OKAY TO SOMEONE ILL. YES, HE ALSO WANTED ME TO GO TO THE NEWS, PUT FOR FEAR OF HIS LIFE I DID NOT. NOW, OUR FAMILY SUFFERS LOSING HIM. THEY SAY HE WAS SUICIDAL, DID NOT PUT HIM ON A WATCH, AND OUR SAYING HE HUNG HIMSELF... MAKES YOU WONDER IF THIS IS EVEN TRUE. IT IS VERY SAD TO SEE SOMEONE GO THRU MOURNING OF SOMEONE CLOSE WHICH HE WAS. HE LOST HIS BROTHER LAST YEAR, AND THEN THEY LOCKED HIM DOWN, GAVE MEDS, (THAT COULD MAKE HIM WORSE) SOMETIMES ON PHONE HIGH FROM MEDS. THIS IS WRONG, WHERE WERE THEY WHEN, IN PRISON SUICIDE MEANS PUTTING A WATCH ON HIM, HE MIGHT HAVE FINALLY BEEN PAROLED THIS YEAR. THEY DID NOT WANT TO DEAL WITH HIM, SO OUR FAMILY LOST HIM AND HIS BROTHER WHO WAS NOT IN PRISON. LOOK INTO ALOT OF THE CASES YOU WILL SEE. HOPE MORE LAWSUITS

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player13 at 8:29 PM PST Monday, November 12, 2007 wrote:

it pays to commit a crime!

Its amazing how people think its ok for somebody to kill somebody and then claim they deserve all these right, because blow holes like some of the above say its their constitutional right. I know people who are Correctional Officers and for any one to insult them like some of you have is sad. None of you dirt bags would last a minute inside those walls with all these killers, gang members, ect... Its easy for all you armchair quarterback to sit in front of your computer and spill these hatefule things about C/O's and say how bad things are in PRISON, but it prison, not club med. Prison is not ment to be a place of fun and fair. Prison is to teach people a lesson for the crimes they commit and set an example to others that prison is no joke. Heck, a homeless person on the street has no free medical, free clothes, a bed to sleep on, showers, and 3 meals a day, yet a prisoner in CA. does. Were is the justice in that. Hell, homeless people should commit crimes so they can get locked up.

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norweb at 11:13 PM PST Monday, November 12, 2007 wrote:

Way to go

Federal Courts are the only place to get any justice. It is an eye opener to see that individual jurors don't want to see prisoners tortured. When will the wardens understand that? 

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triggerfish at 11:57 PM PST Monday, November 12, 2007 wrote:

to insightful - aka ms bird think about this

the 13th amendment to the constitution states "neither slavery or involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the US. Now examine the "except" sentence. Seem that he was duly convicted so by direct statements of the constitution amendment XIII it is acceptable for prisoners to be subject to involuntary servitude. Involuntary servitude means that he is subject to doing what someone in authority directs him to do whether he likes it or not. Based on this thought where does he have the right to go outside? He is subject to involuntary servitude so how can it be cruel and unusual that he doesn't get to go out and play? By our own constitution hard labor for convicted criminals is lawful therefore how could he play at all if he should be working involuntarily. Society shouldn't pay the criminal - the criminal should pay society. What ever happened to Hard Labor?

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triggerfish at 12:09 AM PST Tuesday, November 13, 2007 wrote:

in continuation to insightful

Why don't you solve the whole problem and save the taxpayers a bunch of money by paying for all the care of these " Mentally Ill". And while you're at it how about you pay for all the injuries and additional crimes these poor abused inmates do when they get let out and resume their lives of crime. The point that is so often taken about the Cruel and unusual section of the constitution is that it doesn't really say just what is cruel and unusual - nothing about health care, or missing your play time or that you can't have broken cookies with your food - that has been forced upon us by the decisions of liberal judges. The original meaning had to do with things like drawn and quartering or disemboweling. Your anti law rhetoric claiming that is all mental illnes seems to have rubbed off on yourself. Why should any law abiding taxpayer be forced to pay for any criminals care other than locking them away from society. Want more care - let their family pay for them 

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triggerfish at 12:40 AM PST Tuesday, November 13, 2007 wrote:

one last coment to insightful

I won't try to rebut your statements because there are so many yet 90% of what you state is inaccurate. For example the meals served are considered heart smart and are low salt and fat. The inmates get the salt and fat from all the snacks and soup items they eat from the canteen. What military study did on group punishment did you see that didn't work. Every example of such in boot camp worked perfectly. Prison provides ALL the basic needs - a place to sleep, water, food, and clothing. Phone calls, letter writing materials etc are not basic needs - just check out some child in a poor country. Lockdowns don't come from some inmate "just breaking the rules" - they come from serous threat to safety and security of the institution. And please show me the law that states prisoners should be let out every day in the sun. For just once why don't you get your head out of ----- and realize that blaming crime on mental illness still doesn't solve crime - holding persons responsible does

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WHATTHA at 3:22 AM PST Tuesday, November 13, 2007 wrote:

IT PAYS TO GET ALL THAT OVER-TIME...

and with lock-downs.....ooooohhhh that's easy money !

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ZzyzxExit at 6:58 AM PST Tuesday, November 13, 2007 wrote:

TO: player13

Thank you for so eloquently describing myself and others here who you disagree with as blow holes and dirt bags.

Your juvenile diatribe says all that needs to be said in depicting who you are. You haven't a clue of what OUR country is all about, especially OUR constitution and bill of rights and OUR state constitution.

The inmate who won the lawsuit my be the worst piece of garbage on the planet, but we as a nation of laws MUST live by our laws. That goes for prison administrators right on down to guards and you and me. If we don't live by OUR laws then we are no better than the inmates we lock up and they win. Remember it is Equal Protection for All. That is what makes OUR country great. Take those protections away and we become a nation no better than where the terrorist breed. Is that what you want?

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ZzyzxExit at 7:34 AM PST Tuesday, November 13, 2007 wrote:

TO: triggerfish

I took a few moments to read your previous post and the picture is quite clear. People who embrace a world of a hundred years ago and support instituting Turkish type prisons here in the U.S. and who work for the CDCR is alarming. That attitude is contrary to what the state hopes to accomplish ... make available rehabilitative programs to hopefully curb the recidivism rate that is currently the highest in the nation.

If you disagree with court rulings that have come from as high as the state supreme and United States Supreme Court, you are free to disagree. But keeping inmates locked in their cells for months at a time is cruel and unusual. Even inmates in Ad-Seg and death row are allowed 10 hours a week out of their cells. The term "Safety and Security of the Institution" is a catch all phrase that is all too often abused by administrators.

As to the mentally ill in prison, they are frequently tormented and abused by guards, inmates and other staff. I have witnessed this.
 

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mb4993 at 3:21 PM PST Tuesday, November 13, 2007 wrote:

Wow, lots of reading.............

simply put, a criminal is a criminal and should do his/her time. All these amenities like outside, working out, TV ...........shouldn't happen. Pay back society for your crime. You have two sides to the issue. 

Criminal and how to care for him 
Victim and how to care for them 

Why, under any circumstance would a criminal receive more from this system than the victim did. 3 walls and a set of bars, small toilet, food and a uniform. That's what they earned. They lost their rights when they took the rights of another.

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triggerfish at 6:40 PM PST Tuesday, November 13, 2007 wrote:

ZzyzxExit - consider this

was it not cruel and unusual for the victims of the criminals? Why make prisons nice? Prison should be a deterrent to crime not a place for the criminal to get supported by the lawful taxpayers while he gets free training, college, medical care. Society wants to be safe from crime - three strikes law was a overwhelming majority vote. The idea isn' t to reduce recidivism, Its to stop the crime in the first place. Rehabilitation only works if the person being rehabilitated wants to change. Locking someone in a cell doesn't make them turn into a criminal or make them mentally insane - just ask the POWs of the last several wars or the survivors of the holocost. How many of those people got rehabilitation. The constitution says nothing about going outside to play while incarcerated and it doesn't define what is cruel and unusual, yet it does clearly state that a duly convicted prisoner can be placed in slavery or involuntary servitude (Amendment XIII). 

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dr560 at 7:31 PM PST Tuesday, November 13, 2007 wrote:

Prison is SUPPOSED to be rotten, not FUN.

Why is it, "Insightful_genius" and a few others, that you appear to feel inmates should have the right to basically have all the ammenities free people enjoy? Don't you think prison should be a place that is NOT enjoyable? It seems to me that some of you people feel it should be some sort of club-med where the criminals are kept away from society but have anything they wish. 

I seriously doubt all the Correctional Officers are as bad as you state. By the way - why is it okay for you to make all encompassing statements, but then when someone disagrees with you they must be one of the bad people who work in the prison? 

I'm sorry, I guess I must be one of those horrible, torturing individuals because I think people who are in prison are there for a reason - punishment and keeping them away from the society to which they are a threat. Right now they even get cable TV, paid for by the taxpayer. Real nice!

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ZzyzxExit at 8:28 PM PST Tuesday, November 13, 2007 wrote:

Triggerfish

There are plenty of POW's from Viet Nam (my era) who lost it in captivity. There are countless survivors of the holocaust who never regained a level of sanity. Look at what both groups were subjected to and maybe, just maybe you might see the truth of how fragile some human beings can be.

Prison is not a nice place. The constitution may not define what is cruel and unusual, but the courts have repeatedly. I am not shocked that there are those like you working in so-called corrections because the profession draws those who have a penchant for cruelty to others.

Yes, there are those in prison who should never see the light of freedom ever again. But to deprive that group of civil relief you deprive it to the whole and that is totally against our system of laws. As long as you and others paint all inmates with the same brush the system will remain dysfunctional to where a 100 new prisons will be needed. The voters were fooled with three strikes and you know it.

Yard recall ...

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ForTruth at 9:38 PM PST Tuesday, November 13, 2007 wrote:

God kept my daughter alive.

My daughter was staved of water for 14 days in a Ca.state prison,left laying in her blood,stool,urine and vomit,unconscious for 10 days.I would call this attempted murder.

Another time she was beaten by guards almost 50 bruises all over her body. Given nothing for her pain,and had no human contact for four days in all this. 
.I would call this abuse_ sick and perverted. 

There has to be rules to follow,or this kind of stuff happens. Guards think they can impose punishment,torture,and abuse,and get away with it. 

When I had a stand off with the associate warden,he was so mad; when he shook my hand he hurt my hand. He was good enough to call me though and tell me what happened to my daughter,and how they carried her out unconscious and washed her off.

I'm still not over what he told me they did to her,It's been several years and I still cry. Jesus helps me,and I know my prayers were answered,because God kept my daughter alive.I have the medical report all the bruises depicted.

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triggerfish at 11:43 AM PST Wednesday, November 14, 2007 wrote:

ZzyzxExit - you mised again

Your statement "I am not shocked that there are those like you working in so-called corrections because the profession draws those who have a penchant for cruelty to others." is totally incorrect. I for one used to think like you that prison was a terrible place. Until I saw the difference with my own eyes. Saw the murders, robbers and real persons with a penchant for cruelty getting better care than those Vietnam vets that you associated with (I was one). I've watched gang stabbings, brutal attacks and general mayhem. I've listened to these criminals brag how prison is no Big deal. And Seen so many return, not because they were mistreated, rather that they needed a vacation from their responsibilities. I watch daily good honest hardworking officers try to do their job get spit on, gassed, or assaulted. Cruel people? wrong, people just like everybody else. I've spent my entire life helping others and found out that the victims of crime are the ones who need the help.

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Insightful_genius at 2:26 PM PST Wednesday, November 14, 2007 wrote:

Less than 30% of the prisoners are in for a "violent" crime

Triggerfish - With the preventable death toll so high and attitudes such as yours, I am surprised that only one guard has been killed by a mentally ill inmate who broke under the pressure.Not only have state and federal courts set definite parameters on inmate treatment, but Google is full of studies that you can access. Today, it is considered by most nations contradictory to the modern concept of due process, where each individual receives separate treatment based on his or her role in the crime in question. Article 33 of the Fourth Geneva Convention specifically forbids collective punishment. One law that needs to be passed is that prison guards have at least an AA that includes education in history, government, first aid, CPR, sociology and psychology NOT TO MENTION THE LAW WHICH EVERYONE NEEDS TO RESPECT AND FOLLOW. It is clear from the guard's comments that they are lacking in human understanding, compassion and legal knowledge and that's just for starters.

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Insightful_genius at 2:30 PM PST Wednesday, November 14, 2007 wrote:

To Triggerfish - about the unhealthy diets adding to health expenses

The prisoners are never served any "real" meat and each day they get a cold mystery meat sandwich for lunch. I took a college nutrition class last year and ran the prison menus by the professors, all accomplished doctors of nutritional studies. Not one agreed that what the prisoners are being served is a healthy diet. I don't know what kind of dietician would call potatoes, white bread, macaroni and the absence of a variety of fresh fruits and vegetables a healthy diet. Probably one that the state hired and told to make those recommendations. 

the government's own scientists says people are to have these basics in order to be healthy 

www.pyramid.gov 

are the prisoners getting healthy fruits and vegetables and least some real meat, chicken or fish that isn't processed and full of salt and preservatives? NO. Their diets are very unhealthy and the quantities are inadequate, especially when they are in ad seg being starved on "punishment diets." There's more

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Insightful_genius at 2:36 PM PST Wednesday, November 14, 2007 wrote:

Triggerfish - you don't care about crime victims

The families of prisoners are crime victims and they suffer each and every day that their fathers, sons, uncles, husbands and other relatives are in prison suffering abusive lockdowns, ad seg confinement, intimidation and filthy, unhealthy, overcrowded living conditions. 

If you care about crime victims, then how about working for those who are unseen, such as the family members of prisoners instead of treating them as criminals? 

The hateful attitudes and comments touch millions of lives and at some point those voters are going to rebel and go to the poll and vote dungeons out of existence. The prisons are torturing people and then unleashing them back into the communities much worse off than before incarceration. There are many families who would love to take care of their own mentally ill children who shouldn't be in prison at all. Your jingos don't make sense and I can only ask who told you all that illogical nonsense that you mutter which isn't based in fact. Did I answer?

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ZzyzxExit at 7:48 PM PST Wednesday, November 14, 2007 wrote:

Triggerfish - No, you missed again.

I reiterate, there are those in prison who should never see freedom again. As far as I am concerned that applies to all gang bangers who refuse to give up the life and of course all LWOP's, repeat Chesters and the few other category's who fall under 290PC. I would welcome a change in the law back to ISL and scrapping DSL because it is a failure. There is no accountability for an inmate to be worthy of parole, no meaningful benchmarks to be met.

It is sad that you appear to paint all inmates with the same brush as being unsalvageable. I guess if you work in a slaughterhouse long enough you become anesthetized to where all you see is bad. I have empathy for all victims of crime but detest those who become professional victims. Healthy healing is the ability to move on and drop the chain of hate that binds one to the perpetrator.

Please do not patronize me with rhetoric that all guards are good. We both know better. We also know that we will never agree ... for I am blue you are green.

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jesuschick44 at 9:20 PM PST Wednesday, November 14, 2007 wrote:

Praise the Lord

Just becaues they are in prison does not mean that they should be treated in this manner. I would like to see more prisons have to pay for the wrong doings and treatement of the inmates. Maybe these wardens will see that it can be done, and change they way that they run and treat the inmates. 

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Insightful_genius at 10:14 AM PST Thursday, November 15, 2007 wrote:

Less than 30% of the prisoners committed a violent crime

Of those who did, most are severely mentally ill. The mentally ill cannot follow the rules, this is what makes them mentally ill. There is a very small percentage of people in prison who need to be removed from society as they are a danger to themselves and others. This should be done in a healing manner from which everyone would benefit. Retributive type of punishment has never worked and will never work to deter crime. It is simply a practice from the dark ages and all you blue and green men who are capitalizing off the suffering of mishandled foster children who end up in these bloodhouses had better be aware that the little pink moms and have had enough of your violence and practices from the dark ages. Every prisoner is somebody's child and nobody with a loved one being tortured can ever "heal" because the pain is re-inflicted daily. Clean it up or we will take it all away from you. There are 3 million people, mostly women, who could be voting prisons out of existence.

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triggerfish at 12:04 PM PST Thursday, November 15, 2007 wrote:

ZzyzxExit - still wrong

Thats where you're still wrong. Nowhere did I state that all inmates are unsalvagable. what I did state is that #1 they are all duly convicted. You and others that use the rhetoric that the criminals are the victims seem to paint all Corrections Officers, Police and Public officials as being the law breakers, cruel and unforgiving. "knuckledraggers" is the most common term. As I stated before one has to want to rehabilitate before rehabilitation can happened. I'm all for criminals amending their ways and not returning. I try daily to encourage these behavioral changes. As far as abuse - BS if I ever saw a officer physically abusing an inmate I'd be the first to report it. I do see, daily it seems, inmates attacking inmates and staff. But as I stated the average inmate has multiple counts in his file - the one strike inmate is very rare. But I'm sick and tired of all the whining that prison is cruel and inmates are victims. Don't do crime, don't come to prison

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Insightful_genius at 12:57 PM PST Thursday, November 15, 2007 wrote:

Lockdowns and cell searches are caused to get Overtime & bring in more guard workers

Not every inmate has control over their behavior and I for one do not want my tax dollars being used to punish the sick. Further, the courts are corrupt from arrest through parole and it is the politicians who are sending too many people to prison for crimes that aren't really crimes. 

Since guards and administrators are breaking laws then they will soon be in prison themselves. The entire federal takeover is necessary because the criminals are wearing the badges and people are dying preventable deaths. 

The suicide rate is the highest in the nation. 

At what point are guards and administrators going to learn the laws and follow them? At least the prisoners are mentally ill but what is your excuse? Recent studies have shown that psychological torment has the same effect as physical torture. These are not animals you're playing power games with but people's loved ones. SVSP has been on lockdown for 1 month due to a piece of missing fence probably cut by a guard on purpose

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Insightful_genius at 1:02 PM PST Thursday, November 15, 2007 wrote:

Prisons are full of first time offenders

Triggerfish, would you like me to publish a list of first time and only time offenders who are in prison? Do you think everyone is guilty of a heinous crime or guilty of any crime at all? Educate yourself on what's really taking place, on the laws and consider that it could be your child in prison someday, or more likely, YOU could end up there. Plenty of guards are very sick, have extensive records for spousal abuse and there is a very thin line between those who are attracted to this type of work and the inmates themselves. If the guards were following the laws, the courts would not be intervening. When the moms intervene, you will be blustering your tough-on-crime nonsense standing in the soupline. Be warned. The Bible says we are treat prisoners as if they were Christ himself and everyone is remanded to visit those in prison to help with their healing. The State has blocked visitors to the point that Christians cannot do this, we know what is being hidden and we're talking

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ZzyzxExit at 1:27 PM PST Thursday, November 15, 2007 wrote:

Triggerfish - End of story ...

I have witnessed guards abuse inmates, physical as well as psychological. It happens in nearly every prison in the state on a daily basis with Transportation being one of the biggest offenders. I am not blind, nor am I deaf. I asked that you not patronize me with superficial assumptions that I do not know the truth.

I have walked the yards of Calipatria IV, Tehachapi IV and a variety of level III facilities. In addition, I do not fit the stereotype as I have no tattoos, I do not use drugs, I have all my teeth, I am college educated and I can vote. As to your statement that inmates receive "better care than those Vietnam vets that you associated with." My association was as a member of the 173d Airborne Brigade ... AKA the HERD with15 jumps in country and more encounters with Mr Victor Charlie than I care to remember. Once again you assumed wrong. My experiences with the VA have been better than with an MTA or prison Doctor.

This debate is over ... best to ya and have a good one!

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ZzyzxExit at 6:27 PM PST Thursday, November 15, 2007 wrote:

TO: Insightful_genius

Often I bypass your post as run on and too lengthy to consume. Your last post here deserve an ovation for being right on. Please accept my applause. 

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one2vegas at 1:38 AM PST Friday, November 16, 2007 wrote:

I am standing and applauding right now,and for all of next year !!!

Great posts,Insightful genius and ZzyxExit~~~Great rounds of educational knowledge,any of us,our children,and friends are vulnerable,to becoming a prison number,with all these,crazy laws designed for filling up the prisons,just more excuses, to build,build,build more prisons,in our children's name,for the sake of public safety,as the politicians,want us to believe~~they have lied enough to us,its time to unite,for justice for all,and confront the oppressors,and recognize the divide,they are creating,which has us, all fighting among each other~~simple acts of mistakes,are criminalized grossly,just to get bodies to fill,the prisons~~the only ones who profit are the politicians and the corporations~not even the guards profit,they too are viewed as disposable slaves,watching over,the other slaves~~ Wake up,everyone,and smell the corruption,before,its too late,to make the changes,necessary,for human survival and for all living breathing creations,of God All-mighty !!!! Peace B within U~~~

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dr560 at 8:21 AM PST Friday, November 16, 2007 wrote:

Diluted Info?

Poor Medical? What about the inmates who get serviced at Mercy Folsom and UC Davis Medical Center. That's pretty good medical care, and definitely better than the VA. Free drugs, who gets that type of service? The inmates! 

Poor Treatment? I've seen what they are served, they get better food than most chow halls serve to our military, especially those in the desert. And the inmate's food is free, the soldier has to pay. The get free mail service with State envelopes, yet the soldier has to pay for his/hers. How many color T.V.'s do you see in a foxhole, with cable service no less? Another pay service for everyone else. Special prepared meals for whatever religion the inmate so desires? I think these guys have it made for being jail!

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ZzyzxExit at 9:01 AM PST Friday, November 16, 2007 wrote:

TO: dr560

Where are you getting your information, TV shows or some other fictional source. Please provide me a prison menu that surpasses a military menu, show me a receipt from a solder who has paid for a meal while serving, show me documentation that inmates have cable TV (free or otherwise). Prison food is just barely fit for humans. All of your statements are lies or half truths. 

We all have free mail service ... we pay for postage. The only inmates who receive free postage are those who are indigent (less that $1 on account) and the amount is limited to five envelopes per week. The state does provide special religious meals for orthodox Jews and others, with an established record of affiliation to their religion.

I get so sick of people who are armed with fictional or half truths about prison and put it forth as fact. Didn't your parents teach you not to lie? Come on, back up your statements with the facts. 

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Insightful_genius at 10:55 AM PST Friday, November 16, 2007 wrote:

The food is mostly starch and diabetics are being abused

The prisoners' TVs are furnished by their families, those who have a family. Go sit in your bathroom for a month without a television and see what shape you're in when you come out. Some inmates never get out of ad seg or isolation cells. The TV is their only contact with the news and remember, they will need to be ready to return some day. Should they come back years behind? The inmates would be less likely to riot if the TV was educational and taught them relationship skills, religious tolerance and art, how to use the computer, something that everyone needs to learn. Those who don't have families to send them food are literally being nutritionally starved and we the taxpayers will pay for their high medical bills. In order to be taken to a clinic of any kind, the prisoner must be nearly dead. Shumake died of a dental infection, Swisher died of simple pneumonia, Brown died from being pepper sprayed to death by guards under a spit mask. About 400 non violent men will die this year

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pamom70 at 8:10 PM PST Saturday, November 17, 2007 wrote:

Don't commit crime

If you abide by the laws, you don't have to worry about going to prison. 

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pamom70 at 5:46 PM PST Sunday, November 18, 2007 wrote:

Norwood should....

Give all of the money to his dead victim's family. This jury was out of their minds. 

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